Every team has holes. That’s the nature of the NFL. My concerns about the subjects of some of your takes is that I really don’t have enough faith in the coaching and use of players on D and the OL to know wether regression or non development is primarily due to ability.

Too much regression, too many players seemingly used against strengths or in ways that seem to not put them individually or as a group in a position to succeed. Until we clear out the coaching I don’t see this getting clearer or better.

I can’t end the season on a positive note. The season ended against the NYG, with four games left. Obviously not mathematically, but for all intents and purposes. It’s the earliest we have had a season end since McCarthy’s final season.
MLF, his players and staff reiterated their commitment to ending the season the following week.
And if you cling to the mathematical aspect of the season not being over….MLF made sure that didn’t matter when he decided his friend Joe Barry mattered more than the Packers final season standing.
Although you would also be right if you said LeFleur made that decision in July.

When you list the holes like this, the Packers have a big hill to climb. And, a redo on our RBs is probably needed. So while coaching remains the hot topic, talent gaps are perhaps the biggest concern for growth. I am not a fan of Gutekunst's draft style but I do like our pro scouting department. We are not strong in either trench and that will set the ceiling for this team going forward.

Holes are one thing, coaching is another. Look at Minnesota's defense.

Lots of holes and was porous last year. So what do they do? Hire Brian Flores (who I wanted) - and Flores is doing a lot more with a lot less talent. So the point is, coaching matters. Leadership matters. Some of these guys like Stokes, Walker, etc. absolutely need a new defensive coordinator. LaFleur missed a chance to fire Barry.

The saying in coaching circles goes, “that which will be done eventually, must be done immediately.”

It will be interesting to see how well Bryce Young does against this broken scheme.

"Wouldn't it be funny if the Packers decided to mess with the Bears by tanking against Carolina on Sunday?"

Wouldn't it be funny if the Packers lost to Carolina Sunday, Bryce Young looked like Joe Montana, and Chubba Hubbard and company ran for 200 yards?

Funny? Ummm, Hell no.
Possible? Absolutely!
Surprising? Not in the least.

IF Carolina beats the Packers Sunday and Barry's defense PLAYS like it has the last two weeks, can we please switch the attention to WHY Matt LaFleur SHOULD be fired instead of Joe Barry? Hell, I can make an argument now for it but some STILL think he deserves to be back.

If they don't fix the "holes" in the trenches or can't figure out how to do it, the biggest "hole" is coaching.

Trying to tweak skill positions is a "hole too far and doesn't matter if the lines aren't fixed.

Please quit being bullied. Winning by cleverness and trickery is not sustainable in the NFL. Toughness, strength and depth are the only thing that is sustainable.

If Zach Tom is their best tackle, why not put him on the left side? Or if center is truly his best position, put him there. Either way, they need OL help. RB’s can come from anywhere.
I’ll not comment on the D at this juncture.

For me this discussion should wait until the season is over. Yes, we can claim that for all intents and purposes this season is already over but the NFL is a week to week league. Defeating the chiefs one week and losing to the Giants the next proves that point.

What we know about this Packers team is not likely to change significantly over the next three weeks but you never know. In any case the Packers have plenty of work to do in the off season as the transition from the post-Rodgers era continues.

I'm not confident that much will happen until the Packers fundamental philosophy as an organization changes. That will require bringing in solid NFL personnel and returning to a traditional let the GM run the entire football operation with the cap guru and HC reporting to the GM while the GM reports to the organization's President.

The Packers began to go off the track when Murphy went off to build Titletoen while TTs health was declining. Then in an over reaction to that situation Murphy reorganized the FO with the GM, Cap guru and HC all reporting to him as equals. That decision has hurt the team. The Packers need a President who allows the GM to run the entire football operation and who is 100% focused on the football operation rather than someone who is focused on several non-football operations in addition to the team. Hire professionals and let them do their jobs. Murphy's decisions to restructure the FO and then to hire MLF after one 2 hour meeting were bad decisions. His third strike was his "we're not idiots" decision to give Rodgers a huge salary cap eating contract rather than moving on from Rodgers after 2021.

Those 3 decisions plus a few others have brought the Packers to their current situation. I'm afraid that we have no choice but to wait until 2025 and Murphy's replacement before we will see significant changes in the Packers organization for the better. The current FO has no sense of urgency to change their approach until then. Thanks, Since '61

I believe that this season has been of huge importance in the development of Jordan Love AND MLF. I think MLF has really grown and blossomed as an offensive coordinator, sans the training wheels of ARod as his QB 1, he really has been very good developing his young offensive talent and generally calls a pretty good game. He has failed as a head coach however. A HC is the CEO of the football team, in charge of offense, defense, ST, culture, attitude and direction. Coaches like Belichek, Harbaugh, Tomlin, Shannahan and Reid are tremendous CEO's and their teams all have a consistent and steady culture that easily survives coordinator changes. The Packers haven't had this type of coach since Holmgren and opted this time for the exact same formula they used with McCarthy and are getting the same results. Unless MLF can mature and grow into that executive role we all can just hope lightning can strike again like it did in 2010.

Since MLF refuses to fire Barry and Barry refuses to change his play calling I suggest that if they insist on keeping Barrry on the payroll for the net 3 games then have someone else on the defensive staff actually call the schemes. They don't need coordinator experience Barry has almost 5 yrs DC expeeience, so experience is no guarantee of success for the next 3 games. Turn the players into an aggressive defense, what do we have to lose?
Insanity doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results but thats what Barry wants to do and has expressed that he won't change. Total arrogance and incompetence!

I like many of the author's points, but thought he was a bit harsh on Jordan Love. Love has exceeded expectations this year and is evolving into a good starting quarterback. Yes, he has some mechanical issues, but even as talented a thrower of the football as Aaron Rodgers was working on his mechanics late into his career. I think Love deserved a bit more positive review for his development this season.

"With 31-year-old Preston Smith a candidate for release to save some cap over time,"

The Packers can make out about as well cap-wise by getting Smith to take a pay cut and an adjustment on his 2024 roster bonus. He's not going to command very much on the open market, so it might be to his advantage to accept the pay cut. He's still playing well and has been a good citizen and locker-room leader. Enagbare, Cox, and Van Ness are still cost-controlled, young options. I could see them going either way.

The Old Labrador woke me up at 3:00 AM, couldn't get back to sleep, so I ran the first draft simulation '24: PFN version. All top OTs off the board by #10. Rome Udunze gone at #8. Comp picks unknown. Trades likely.
#11 Cooper DeJean Safety/CB Iowa
#38 Quinyon Mitchell CB Toledo
#42 Jordan Morgan LT Arizona
#76 Edge Cooper ILB Texas A&M
# 82 Bucky Irving RB Oregon
#107 Delmar Glaze OT Maryland
#172 Dillon Johnson RB Washington
#203 Xavier Watts S Notre Dame

Let loose the Mockery...

In the spirit of the holidays, may we all remember that you don't purchase a drill because you need a drill, you purchase a drill because you need holes.

A year from now this will all look very different.

I have started to lose interest as the dysfunction continues. Multi-billion corporations should not be running in this fashion. And, waiting till 2025 is out of the question for me. If I see positive movement such as the selection of a good DC (@ least), I will remain invested but if LaF is retaining Barry, I won't stick around as it's not good for my blood pressure and general wellbeing.
I've dropped a dysfunctional team before after 15 years of poor play.They are now the best team in the NFL but I only have a passing interest in them. I guess it's like falling out of love.

Amazing that the lack of pride in the piss poor job Barry has done he himself doesn't recognize the train wreck he made he doesn't just resign and the embarrassment of being fired. He is in hole deep enough already, who will again hire him for anything football related of importance!

For players like Savage and Stokes, I think you have to wonder if Barry isn't putting them in bad positions and that has caused some of the decline. Campbell though, just looks hesitant to tackle and is slow getting to the ball carrier. Injury or not, it been that way since he signed his contract. I'm not too concerned about Wyatt yet as its typical for a Defensive Lineman to take 3 years to really acclimate to the NFL. The team and DC are built to play with a lead, not shut anyone down. More than anything, I think the culture of the defense needs to change.

What is especially concerning is that at the beginning of the season we thought we had a lot of the defensive questions on personnel answered; it was the offense where we really weren't sure what to expect. Walker and Stokes have regressed from their somewhat promising rookie seasons and Savage has been in regression for a while. These are all first round picks and we cannot afford this either now or any more in the future.

So while we all hope and pray we go in a new direction with the defense moving forward, big turnarounds usually involve adding at least a couple of new starters. One of the biggest turnarounds in history occurred in 1981 with San Francisco as they fielded four new starters. I do like a couple of the suggestions noted here, but we all know how Gute feels about his draft picks, so we'll see.

Like many other fans, I thought it prudent that the offensive line be addressed early in the upcoming draft, and it's still a good idea. But the fact that there are still so many holes on this team muddies the waters a little bit, leaving us largely in BPA territory again.

Looks like i have a problem on my hands.

My thumbs up are catching up to my thumbs down.

That is starting to make me feel very uncomfortable, like i'm 'conforming' or something.

For my New Years resolution i'm going to try refraining from being so damn charming and adorable.

Campbell isn’t cooked unless he wants to leave.
And I wouldn’t spend one dime anywhere, unless it’s RB.
Patrick Queen = LOL- everyone here said he sucked. I didn’t.
Quay Walker is a thumbs up. But I ‘d draft this position.
Because how many stokes do you want? Most run 4.5.
And he isn’t going to let Valintine beat him out.

Kenny Clark should be the NT every time there in a Blitz.
Slaton doesn’t have a sack. Raji did until they moved him.
I get the grave digger stuff. But Clark and Wyatt aren’t turtles.

P. Smith is slowing. Try counting his counts like Peppers.

Jaire isn't going anywhere but back on the IR.
He’s small and he can’t keep tackling without hurting his shoulder.
And if you look at the height of the draft class.
(You Keep your fingers crossed.)

To much value on the Ol this draft.
Jenkins was a 2nd rd. Bahk 3rd. It’s that deep again.

Coaching Overhaul-
MLF and Love are a Combo.
Barry can go if you change the front.
But after 3 Dcs with the 3-4-4.??
Go ahead and make it 4.
I’ll say Told you So!!!

Some of this seems to be negative for negativity’s sake. For example, Walker was terrible the first few games but now is second to Trent Williams in pass block win rate. I assume the motivation behind these unrealistically negative assessments is to stir the pot.

A coaching overhaul is a must for this team. LaFleur- if he is truly a HC - needs to find an OC he can hand the reins over to - and not to an Olineman. A new DC cannot be in doubt! But please, no more Fangio followers. Even Fangio's current defense in Miami is ranked only 13th best while all the rest of his disciples rank in the bottom third. It doesn't say much for LaFleur that he still wants a Fangio style defense? As much as I've complained that Barry is a dinosaur when it comes to change, I'm beginning to think he and his pal LaFleur are birds of a feather?

Nothing about losing to the Bears would make me smile.

I think it's time to enlarge the scope of the problem...actually, taking away AR & Davante from those season's results, LaFleur hasn't really demonstrated his ability of a supposed excellent HC; admittedly poor play calls, conservative schemes(playing not to lose, instead of to win), poor communication, DC choices(both Pettine & Barry), loss of the locker room !, and a non-command of his position...
It's time to consider at change at BOTH DC & HC; maybe even GM-but I've been a Packer fan since '58, so I've seen the lack of direction in the front office over all these decades-55 years since SBII and only 2 SBs with 2 great QBs...do the math!! Sweep clean the front office top to bottom and start with football-winning people..it is called TITLETOWN USA !!....Lombardi wouldn't have stood for this !